Pujya Sri Mahaswamy Divya Charitram Part#63

13. Interview with Paul Brunton at Chengelput

Swamigal arrived at Chengelput in the beginning of January, 1931. The citizens of Chengelput, who were awaiting his visit for a long time, were extremely happy. All gathered to have his darshan everyday, irrespective of caste or creed, the rich and the poor, the elderly and the youngsters alike. During his stay in the town, he gave lectures every night in the local Siva temple.

Paul Brunton, an Englishman who had emigrated to America, was traveling around our country meeting with Yogis in order to obtain their blessings. After completing his travels in northern India, he came to Chennai with the intention to tour south India. He brought with him, from England, an introduction letter to Sri K.S.Venkataramani, a famous English writer residing in Chennai. Later on, Paul Brunton praised Sri Venkataramani highly in his book ‘A Search in Secret India’.

When he met K.S.Venkataramani, he expressed his desire to meet genuine yogis of South India and to not waste time with pseudo yogis. Venkataramani told him that yogis cannot be found out in the open and that moreover they cannot be easily approached by a European. However, the next day Venkataramani met Paul Brunton at the latter’s residence and said to him, “Sri Sankaracharya of the Kanchi Sankaracharya Mutt, who is the religious head of South India, is now camping at Chengleput. I got this information last night. He is my benefactor and I seek his spiritual guidance. He is the ultimate embodiment of penance and a true sannyasin. Though he may not be a yogi, he knows the truth and intricacies of the path of yoga. He has traveled the cities and villages in this country. People revere him and bow to him, wherever he goes. I think that you may get some useful instructions from him. His camp at Chengleput, is about 35 miles from Madras. But it is doubtful if he will grant you an interview. Yet I shall attempt to help you”. Brunton told the novelist that he would gladly accompany him to Chengleput the next day.

The next day Brunton and Venkataramani left for Chengleput. On the way, Venkataramani described Swamigal’s simple way of life, the biography and greatness of the Adi Acharya of the mutt, Sri Sankara and his Advaitic philosophy. Brunton listened with rapture to all of the above as well as to the history of the mutt. Both of them
reached the house where Swamigal was staying. Venkataramani requested the manager of the Mutt for an interview. But the manager said it was not possible to obtain an interview as thousands were already waiting and moreover he was a European. Later Venkataramani himself requested Swamigal for an audience for Paul Brunton, at which point Swamigal gave him permission to bring Brunton before him. Then Venkataramani conveyed the information to Brunton whose joy knew no bounds. The Englishman brought flower garlands, fruits in a tray and entered the house where Swamigal was
staying. At the far end, there was a small lamp burning. In the dimly lit room, Brunton beheld the short figure standing in the shadows. Hesitantly, he slowly offered the garlands and fruits to Swamigal and prostrated before him. He slowly thanked Swamigal in English for granting this audience. Which Swamigal accepted with his usual bright smiling face. Then the conversation between the two of them started. Paul Brunton started to ask questions about the future of the world and Swamigal replied to them.

Venktaramani acted as the translator for the conversation between Paul Brunton and our Swamigal.

Question: When will the world’s political and economic situation improve and become equitable.

Answer: It is not an easy job to change the world situation. It has to happen in its own time. When world’s super powers are spending enormous amounts of money to manufacture weapons of mass destruction, how can the world improve?

Q: Will there be any useful outcome from the talks that are currently taking place to eradicate weapons?

A: Even if your ships are torn apart or your machine guns get rusted, the fighting will not stop. People will take the sticks and start fighting.

Q: Then, what do you think is the way to obtain world peace?

A: Countries should understand each other spiritually. Similarly, the rich and powerful should recognize the poor. Only then can goodwill towards each other be generated. Goodwill created thus will bring peace amongst countries and benefit to all.

Q: If we see the world filled with turmoil and injustice, it makes us wonder whether or not God really cares about people

A: That is not the correct way to think. A patient man will silently think deeply about the future. God will appear in the form of a human and solve all these problems. The more the discord amongst empires increase, the more the bad activities of the general public increase and the more the poor people suffer, the chances of a turnaround happening becomes higher. A human being with godly powers will appear in the world. Through him, a resolution to all these problems will be seen. Such a great person may be born in any country. The changes in the world will happen step by step in accordance with physical laws. The faster the agnostic beliefs rise and the faster the miseries and sorrows of the people arise, the faster the man to save this world will also appear.

Q: So, do you think that such a person will arise in our times also?

A: Yes. It is possible that this avatar might be born in our country. It has also become necessary for such an avatar. The darkness of ignorance is spreading fast in the world.

Q: Do you think the people of the world have hit rock bottom?

A: No. There is Atma Shakthi (Spiritual power) in every human and this will take him to God finally.

Q: But demons have entered the hearts of human beings in the western world. Their actions prove that. What do you think of that?

A: Do not blame the human race like that. They act according to the circumstances in which they are born into. In reality, no one is a bad person. It is the circumstances that change them and make them act in certain ways. This is true for both eastern and western worlds. A higher philosophy should spread across the world. They should change the perception that what is being seen and
heard is the truth. Instead, humans should comprehend the existence of a power higher than human capacity, that of God. Only then, a solution to the world’s problems can be found.

Q: So, you think it is possible to enforce piety and belief in God into the hearts of the human race in this world?

A: Yes. I think it is possible. Ultimately, this is the only thing that will satisfy everyone. The fruits will not disappear that easily. The more the number of people with spiritual power in this world, the faster the thought will spread. The people of India treat godly persons and saints with great respect. If other countries of this world follow this practice and treat saints with respect and practice their teachings, there will definitely be world peace. Currently there is both good and
bad prevalent in the world. I believe that coming generations would follow the high points of their respective civilizations and be respected citizens of their society.

Q: How many years have you been pontiff of this Peetam?

A: I became a pontiff in the year 1907 at the age of 12.

Q: I think you do not stay for long at the mutt’s headquarters. Am I right?

A: Yes. I have been traveling from village to village in the past fifteen years in this state. My yatra is progressing slowly. I plan to travel to Kasi.

Brunton now starts to converse with our Swamigal on the topic for which he has come here. Swamigal asked Brunton about the sannyasins and yogis that he has met in India so far. He explained in detail his experiences with the sadhus and yogis so far and then started his questioning.

Q: I want to meet a yogi / saint who are experience in yoga and one who can show me the way to attain its benefits. I do not even want to talk to him. You may think that I am desirous of something above my station. Can you help me in this matter?

A: There is nothing wrong in wanting to practice the path of yoga. Your shraddha will benefit you in this path. One needs extreme will power and determination to go this path and I think you have them both. There is a light lit in your heart and that will show you the path for which you are seeking.

Q: I am not able to completely understand what you said. I have been thinking about this for a long time. Ancient rishis of India have said that God resides in our hearts itself. Can you explain this for me?

A: God exists everywhere. One cannot think of him as just existing in our hearts. He is carrying this whole creation.

Q: Can you tell me what path should I take?

A: Continue with your travels and at the end of it , contemplate on all the yogis and sadhus you had met in your travels. Whomsoever you think, you can relate to in your heart, approach him. He will show you your path.

Q: What should I do if I do not find anyone that is satisfactory to my heart?

A: If you do not find any one satisfactory, then you should continue your efforts by yourself. Spend every day in meditation. Stop thinking about silly and trivial matters and engage your mind to think lovingly about higher things. Think often about your atma and that will help you in your sadhana. The best time to practice this is early in the morning. You can meditate in the evenings also. Both the times are peaceful and appropriate for meditation without interruption.

Q: If I do not get any results from my personal efforts, will you help me?

A: I am a head of a public institution. Most of my time from dawn to night is spent in the official duties of this institution. Hence, you have to go in search of a Guru who can spend time with you.

Q: I am told that it is very hard to find a real / true Acharya. It is especially difficult for a European to meet such an Acharya?

A: There are true Acharyas in this world and it is possible to meet them.

Q: Then, can you send me to a true Acharya?

A: I know of two such Acharyas. One of them is living in a dense forest in the southern part of this country, but in silence. Very few people can see him and no European has ever seen him so far. I could send you to him, but he might refuse to see you.

Q: I am eager to know about the other person. Who is he?

A: The other person lives in the country. He is jnani and you can seek him.

Q: Can I obtain more information about him?

A: He is called ‘Maharishi’. He lives in the place called Thiruvannamalai situated in the North Arcot district. If necessary, I will give you details to reach him.

Q: I am very much obligated to you. Another person has come to see me from the same place. I have pulled you away for a long time from your numerous and important official duties. Please excuse me for that. Please give me leave.

A: Yes. I presume that you will definitely go to Thiruvannamalai.

Q: I was planning to complete my South India tour today and had already made arrangements to leave tomorrow. What can I do in this situation?

A: You can decide to change your arrangements and leave South India after meeting with Maharishi. Do not worry. Your desires will be fulfilled.

Paul Brunton promised Swamigal to seek Maharishi, meet him before leaving India. With a heavy heart, he took leave of Swamigal. Later he wrote the following in his book about his experience.

“ And so, hearing these cryptic and puzzling words, I reluctantly withdraw from this interesting man, whose entire life has been dedicated to God from childhood. He is a pontiff who cares not for worldly power, because he has renounced all and
resigned all. Whatever material things are given to him he at once give again to those who need them. His beautiful and gentle personality will surely linger in my memory.”

I roamed the streets of Chengleput at night and enjoyed the sights. I wanted to see Swamigal once more before I left. Swamigal was sitting amongst a big crowd in a local temple and giving a sermon. Even though I could not understand what he was saying, I realized that an educated Brahmin as well as commoners was equally fascinated by his
speech. I was fascinated by Swamigal’s attractive personality. I was jealous of the deep faith in the people gathered there. They have no doubts in their lives. They have the ultimate faith that there is a God. Their minds are not immersed in any other thought about the world’s conditions or destruction of parts of the world, etc.

Later, we left from Chengleput to Chennai in a car. I kept hearing the rustling sounds of water in the side of the road as well as the coconut trees moving with the wind. We traveled silently for sometime and suddenly my friend Venkataramani announced that I was indeed very fortunate. He explained that it was the first time a European author has been accorded permission to get an interview from Swamigal. Hence I have the complete blessings of the Acharya. I was very proud to hear this.

By the time, I reached my place of stay, it was close to midnight. I climbed the stairs of the cottage and took my flash light to the verandah. My friend who had come from Thiruvannamalai to see me woke up from his bed. I asked him what he was doing, for which he grinned and replied that he had promised to meet me before. When I
enquired if his Guru was called ‘Maharishi’, he was surprised. I told him not to worry, that I have changed my plans and intend to travel to Thiruvannamali with him to visit Maharishi. He was extremely happy. We talked with each other for half hour and went to bed.

I must have slept for a little while, when I suddenly woke up. My bedroom was filled with darkness. I felt that the nerves in my body were stiff and charged. The air around me was also charged with current. I took my wristwatch under the pillow and checked the time. It showed quarter to three. At that time, a light showed at the foot of my bed. I immediately got up and looked keenly at the light. My agitated sight found the form of Acharya Swamigal. There was no doubt that the form was no ghost, but a human form. There was light surrounding that form. The bright light of the form and the darkness in the room were very distinctive. There was no doubt that it was the person whom I had seen at Chengleput. To test myself, I closed my eyes shut tightly. I could still see the bright light and the form that had come to show me compassion and love. When I opened my eyes, it was definite that I still saw the form clad in saffron. The lips moved
and it appeared to say “ Be disciplined and you will attain what you desire”. Why should I perceive a human form at this time of the night? Just as the way it appeared, the form disappeared. I found immense peace, happiness and pride in this unusual happening. I could not brush it off as just a dream and I did not get any sleep afterwards. I kept thinking about my encounter with Acharya Swamigal considered as an incarnation of God by the people of South India. ”